Shentong:JonangShangpa: Difference between revisions
Jump to navigation
Jump to search
BenTremblay (talk | contribs) m (→References) |
BenTremblay (talk | contribs) mNo edit summary |
||
Line 8: | Line 8: | ||
: "The contemporary western Kagyu scholar Karl Brunnhölzl argues that there is no such thing as “Yogacara Madhyamaka,” but rather that orthodox Yogacara philosophy (when understood properly) is entirely compatible with Madhyamaka, and therefore no synthesis is needed. He argues that Yogacara has often been mischaracterized and unfairly marginalized in the typical Tibetan Buddhist curriculum."<ref>[http://www.buddhism-guide.com/buddhism/shentong.htm Shentong | Buddhism-Guide.com]</ref> | : "The contemporary western Kagyu scholar Karl Brunnhölzl argues that there is no such thing as “Yogacara Madhyamaka,” but rather that orthodox Yogacara philosophy (when understood properly) is entirely compatible with Madhyamaka, and therefore no synthesis is needed. He argues that Yogacara has often been mischaracterized and unfairly marginalized in the typical Tibetan Buddhist curriculum."<ref>[http://www.buddhism-guide.com/buddhism/shentong.htm Shentong | Buddhism-Guide.com]</ref> | ||
---- | ---- | ||
<br /> | |||
: "Pettit (1999: p.113) qualifies and disambiguates 'Great Madhyamaka' and mentions Mipham, Longchenpa, Prasangika Madhyamaka, Tsongkhapa and coalescence: | : "Pettit (1999: p.113) qualifies and disambiguates 'Great Madhyamaka' and mentions Mipham, Longchenpa, Prasangika Madhyamaka, Tsongkhapa and coalescence: | ||
:: "Extrinsic emptiness is also referred to as "Great Madhyamaka" (dbu ma chen po), a term that appears frequently in Mipham's works. This term can also be misleading, because dbu ma chen po does not refer exclusively to extrinsic emptiness. Klong chen pa and Mipham use it to refer to Prasangika Madhyamaka, because it emphasizes the nonconceptual ultimate, which they understand as the principle of coalescence. Tsongkhapa also uses this term in passing, for example, in the colophon of his dBu ma dgongs pa rab gsal." | :: "Extrinsic emptiness is also referred to as "Great Madhyamaka" (dbu ma chen po), a term that appears frequently in Mipham's works. This term can also be misleading, because dbu ma chen po does not refer exclusively to extrinsic emptiness. Klong chen pa and Mipham use it to refer to Prasangika Madhyamaka, because it emphasizes the nonconceptual ultimate, which they understand as the principle of coalescence. Tsongkhapa also uses this term in passing, for example, in the colophon of his dBu ma dgongs pa rab gsal." | ||
Line 15: | Line 16: | ||
: "Courtesy of Cyrus Stearns, author of "The Buddha from Dolpo" and a member of Jonang Foundation's Board of Directors, we have recently added four new short translations to our expanding online library. These additions include 2 texts by Dolpopa, ''one by the 16th century '''Jonang and Shangpa Kagyu master Kunga Drolchok''''', and one by Drolchok's own teacher Lochen Ratnabhadra."<ref>[http://www.jonangfoundation.org/news?page=1 "4 New Translations" - News | JonangFoundation.org]</ref> | : "Courtesy of Cyrus Stearns, author of "The Buddha from Dolpo" and a member of Jonang Foundation's Board of Directors, we have recently added four new short translations to our expanding online library. These additions include 2 texts by Dolpopa, ''one by the 16th century '''Jonang and Shangpa Kagyu master Kunga Drolchok''''', and one by Drolchok's own teacher Lochen Ratnabhadra."<ref>[http://www.jonangfoundation.org/news?page=1 "4 New Translations" - News | JonangFoundation.org]</ref> | ||
: "A White Tara Teaching" - "This twenty eighth teaching from the “Jo nang Khrid brgya” of Kunga Drolchok was translated by Palden Lotsawa (James Rutke)." | |||
: Source: Kun dga’ Grol mchog. Sgrol dkar gi khrid yig. In Jo nang Khrid brgya, vol. 18 of the Gdams ngag Mdzod, 183. | |||
---- | ---- | ||
<br /> | <br /> | ||
===Old, and New Again=== | ===Old, and New Again=== | ||
:: "If I am not mistaken the Shang lineage had disappeared as its own school and been dispersed into the other lineages a long time ago with various practices survivng here and there. I believe it was Kalu II that went around and 'collected' all the vaious initiations and lungs that comprised the full lineage and re-consolidated them into a coherent 'school'. If someone knows the history better please let me know." | :: ''"If I am not mistaken the Shang lineage had disappeared as its own school and been dispersed into the other lineages a long time ago with various practices survivng here and there. I believe it was Kalu II that went around and 'collected' all the vaious initiations and lungs that comprised the full lineage and re-consolidated them into a coherent 'school'. If someone knows the history better please let me know."'' | ||
: "It was never a "school," really...at least, not after Mokchokpa, the second lineage holder....the Monastery of Shang pretty much dissolved at that time-as foretold by Khyungpo Naljor. However, the practices of the Shangpa 5 Golden Dharmas were not disseminated at that time--they were a one-to-one transmission until after the seventh holder, and Mokchokpa was only the second holder. So, in a sense, there was never an institution or "school" that practiced the Shangpa Core Teachings-the 5 Golden Dharmas--seperate from other institutional lineages. Just one-to-one transmission for quite some time....<br><br> | : "It was never a "school," really...at least, not after Mokchokpa, the second lineage holder....the Monastery of Shang pretty much dissolved at that time-as foretold by Khyungpo Naljor. However, the practices of the Shangpa 5 Golden Dharmas were not disseminated at that time--they were a one-to-one transmission until after the seventh holder, and Mokchokpa was only the second holder. So, in a sense, there was never an institution or "school" that practiced the Shangpa Core Teachings-the 5 Golden Dharmas--seperate from other institutional lineages. Just one-to-one transmission for quite some time....<br><br> |
Revision as of 17:15, 7 July 2009
- "The contemporary western Kagyu scholar Karl Brunnhölzl argues that there is no such thing as “Yogacara Madhyamaka,” but rather that orthodox Yogacara philosophy (when understood properly) is entirely compatible with Madhyamaka, and therefore no synthesis is needed. He argues that Yogacara has often been mischaracterized and unfairly marginalized in the typical Tibetan Buddhist curriculum."[1]
- "Pettit (1999: p.113) qualifies and disambiguates 'Great Madhyamaka' and mentions Mipham, Longchenpa, Prasangika Madhyamaka, Tsongkhapa and coalescence:
- "Extrinsic emptiness is also referred to as "Great Madhyamaka" (dbu ma chen po), a term that appears frequently in Mipham's works. This term can also be misleading, because dbu ma chen po does not refer exclusively to extrinsic emptiness. Klong chen pa and Mipham use it to refer to Prasangika Madhyamaka, because it emphasizes the nonconceptual ultimate, which they understand as the principle of coalescence. Tsongkhapa also uses this term in passing, for example, in the colophon of his dBu ma dgongs pa rab gsal."
- "After the suppression of the Jonang school and its texts and the texts of Sakya Chokden by the Tibetan government in the 1600s, various Shentong views were propagated mainly by Karma Kagyu and Nyingma lamas. In particular, the 8th Tai Situ Rinpoche (Situ Pa?chen Chökyi Jungné (si tu pa? chen chos kyi 'byung gnas) (1700-1774)) and Katok Tsewang Norbu (ka? thog tshe dbang nor bu) (1698-1755), close colleagues and Karma Kagyu and Nyingma lamas respectively, were very instrumental in reviving Shentong among their sects. Also instrumental was Situ Panchen (1700-1774), senior court chaplain in the Kingdom of Dêgê, a student of Norbu; according to 2003's The Budda from Dolpo, "[i]n the end it would be Situ more than anyone who would create the environment for the widespread acceptance of the Zhentong theories in the next century. This revival was continued by Jamgon Kongtrul Lodro Thaye, a 19th century Rime (ecumenical) scholar and forceful exponent of Shentong, and were also advanced recently by the eminent Kagyu Lamas Kalu Rinpoche and Khenpo Tsultrim Gyamtso Rinpoche."[2]
- "Courtesy of Cyrus Stearns, author of "The Buddha from Dolpo" and a member of Jonang Foundation's Board of Directors, we have recently added four new short translations to our expanding online library. These additions include 2 texts by Dolpopa, one by the 16th century Jonang and Shangpa Kagyu master Kunga Drolchok, and one by Drolchok's own teacher Lochen Ratnabhadra."[3]
- "A White Tara Teaching" - "This twenty eighth teaching from the “Jo nang Khrid brgya” of Kunga Drolchok was translated by Palden Lotsawa (James Rutke)."
- Source: Kun dga’ Grol mchog. Sgrol dkar gi khrid yig. In Jo nang Khrid brgya, vol. 18 of the Gdams ngag Mdzod, 183.
Old, and New Again
- "If I am not mistaken the Shang lineage had disappeared as its own school and been dispersed into the other lineages a long time ago with various practices survivng here and there. I believe it was Kalu II that went around and 'collected' all the vaious initiations and lungs that comprised the full lineage and re-consolidated them into a coherent 'school'. If someone knows the history better please let me know."
- "It was never a "school," really...at least, not after Mokchokpa, the second lineage holder....the Monastery of Shang pretty much dissolved at that time-as foretold by Khyungpo Naljor. However, the practices of the Shangpa 5 Golden Dharmas were not disseminated at that time--they were a one-to-one transmission until after the seventh holder, and Mokchokpa was only the second holder. So, in a sense, there was never an institution or "school" that practiced the Shangpa Core Teachings-the 5 Golden Dharmas--seperate from other institutional lineages. Just one-to-one transmission for quite some time....
- The "Long Tradition," which is what I'm talking about here, passed down and was disseminated through the Karma Kagyu and the Jonang, as well as the Sakya and eventually the Geluk and Nyingma as well. The "Long Tradition" really achieved most of it's final form when Jonang Taranatha wrote out the sadhanas and commentaries on most of the core Shangpa Practices, and gathered together what had been extant at that time. The Jonang tradition, during Taranatha's time, practiced the Shangpa transmissions as well as their own Kalachakra lineage.
- The other "Lineage" of Shangpa Kagyu is more recent and direct, coming from Thangtong Gyalpo.
- Jamgon Kongtrul was chiefly responsible, along with Khytense Rinpoche, for re-popularizing these practices at his retreat center, Tsadra Rinchen Drak, in the 1800's. He wrote down additional practices that Taranatha and others had not written....practices that were oral prior to him.....and he also "completed" or amended some of Taranatha's works. Since he founded that center, the Shangpa 5 Golden Dharmas, as well as the Shangpa Yidam Practices and the Six Armed Mahakala, have been practiced as kind of a subspeciality of the Karma Kagyu. This was associated with Palpung Tradition, though the Tsurphu Tradition also maintained some Shangpa practices, and had since the time of the Third Karmapa.
- Kalu Rinpoche was the third generation of Lamas to do retreat at Tsadra Rinchen Drak, and the third Kongtrul Trulku to focus on these practices, and he, of course, was responsible for the world-wide spread of the Shangpa practices.
- Currently, Sonada Monastery, near Darjeeling, focuses on the Shanga methods. Also, Palpung has stressed Shangpa methods and has had a retreat center devoted to the Shangpa associated with the main monastery. I believe Yangsi Kongtrul's monastery near Pullahari in Nepal also maintains focus on these practices--though Palpung, Pullahari, and Sherab Ling also equally maintain and propagate the Kamtsang practices. I believe the recently-revitalized Jonang institutions, including the one in India, also maintain Shangpa practice. In the West, Kalu Rinpoche's Western centers, including my center, KDK in San Francisco, maintain the Shangpa and also the Kamtsang methods, especially in their retreat centers. Thus, many Western students have had the good fortune to receive the transmission and to train in some way in the methods. And finally, Bokar Ngedon Chokhor Ling, in Mirik, India, has a Shangpa retreat center, as well as Kamtsang and Vajra Yoga (Kalachakra) retreat centers associated with the monastery. Kalu Rinpoche's Yangsi is currently there, in strict retreat, I imagine practicing the Shangpa Methods.
- Hope that helps in understanding the place of the Shangpa Methods in the current landscape of Tibetan Dharma, and a bit of how it came to be here."
reply by conebeckham in forum [4]